Day 2e

Propositions 8

Sep 25, 2025
10 min read 2026 words
Table of Contents

Proposition 8

Given a cylinder or prism of the greatest length consistent with its not breaking under its own weight; and having given a greater length, to find the diameter of another cylinder or prism of this greater length which shall be the only and largest one capable of withstanding its own weight.

Let BC be the largest cylinder capable of sustaining its own weight; and let DE be a length greater than AC: the problem is to find the diameter of the cylinder which, having the length DE, shall be the largest one just able to withstand its own weight.

Let I be a third proportional to the lengths DE and AC; let the diameter FD be to the diameter BA as DE is to I; draw the cylinder FE; then, among all cylinders having the same proportions, this is the largest and only one just capable of sustaining its own weight.

Let M be a third proportional to DE and I: also let O be a fourth proportional to DE, I, and M; lay off FG equal to AC.

Since the diameter FD is to the diameter AB as the length DE is to I, and since O is a fourth proportional to DE, I and M, it follows that FDmacronsup3:BAmacronsup3=DE:O. But the resistance [bending strength] of the cylinder DG is to the resistance of the cylinder BC as the cube of FD is to the cube of BA: hence the resistance of the cylinder DG is to that of cylinder BC as the length DE is to O.

Since the moment of the cylinder BC is held in equilibrium by [è equale alla] its resistance, we shall accomplish our end (which is to prove that the moment of the cylinder FE is equal to the resistance located at FD), if we show that the moment of the cylinder FE is to the moment of the cylinder BC as the resistance DF is to the resistance BA, that is, as the cube of FD is to the cube of BA, or as the length DE is to O.

The moment of the cylinder FE is to the moment of the cylinder DG as the square of DE is to the square of AC, that is, as the length DE is to I; but the moment of the cylinder DG is to the moment of the cylinder BC, as the square of DF is to the square of BA, that is, as the square of DE is to the square of I, or as the square of I is to the square of M, or, as I is to O.

Therefore by equating ratios, it results that the moment of the cylinder FE is to the moment of the cylinder BC as the length DE is to O, that is, as the cube of DF is to the cube of BA, or as the resistance of the base DF is to the resistance of the base BA; which was to be proven.

Fig. 25

Sagredo

This demonstration, Salviati, is rather long and difficult to keep in mind from a single hearing. Will you not, therefore, be good enough to repeat it?

Sagredo
Salviati
Salviati

As you like; but I would suggest instead a more direct and a shorter proof: this will, however, necessitate a different figure.

Sagredo

The favor will be that much greater: nevertheless I hope you will oblige me by putting into written form the argument just given so that I may study it at my leisure.

Sagredo
Salviati
Salviati

I shall gladly do so. Let A denote a cylinder of diameter DC and the largest capable of sustaining its own weight: the problem is to determine a larger cylinder which shall be at once the maximum and the unique one capable of sustaining its own weight.

Let E be such a cylinder, similar to A, having the assigned length, and having a diameter KL.

Let MN be a third proportional to the 2 lengths DC and KL: let MN also be the diameter of another cylinder, X, having the same length as E: then, I say, X is the cylinder sought.

The resistance of the base DC is to the resistance of the base KL as the square of DC is to the square of KL, that is, as the square of KL is to the square of MN, or, as the cylinder E is to the cylinder X, that is, as the moment E is to the moment X.

The resistance [bending strength] of the base KL is to the resistance of the base MN as the cube of KL is to the cube of MN, that is, as the cube of DC is to the cube of KL, or, as the cylinder A is to the cylinder E, that is, as the moment of A is to the moment of E.

Hence it follows, ex æquali in proportione perturbata, that the moment of A is to the moment of X as the resistance of the base DC is to the resistance of the base MN. Therefore, moment and resistance are related to each other in prism X precisely as they are in prism A.

Fig. 26

Salviati
Salviati

Let us now generalize the problem; then it will read as follows:

Given a cylinder AC in which moment and resistance [bending strength] are related in any manner whatsoever; let DE be the length of another cylinder; then determine what its thickness must be in order that the relation between its moment and resistance shall be identical with that of the cylinder AC.

Using Fig. 25 in the same manner as above, we may say that, since the moment of the cylinder FE is to the moment of the portion DG as the square of ED is to the square of FG, that is, as the length DE is to I; and since the moment of the cylinder FG is to the moment of the cylinder AC as the square of FD is to the square of AB, or, as the square of ED is to the square of I, or, as the square of I is to the square of M, that is, as the length I is to O; it follows, ex æquali, that the moment of the cylinder FE is to the moment of the cylinder AC as the length DE is to O, that is, as the cube of DE is to the cube of I, or, as the cube of FD is to the cube of AB, that is, as the resistance of the base FD is to the resistance of the base AB; which was to be proven.

From what has already been demonstrated, you can plainly see the impossibility of increasing the size of structures to vast dimensions either in art or in nature; likewise the impossibility of building ships, palaces, or temples of enormous size in such a way that their oars, yards, beams, iron-bolts, and, in short, all their other parts will hold together; nor can nature produce trees of extraordinary size because the branches would break down under their own weight; so also it would be impossible to build up the bony structures of men, horses, or other animals so as to hold together and perform their normal functions if these animals were to be increased enormously in height; for this increase in height can be accomplished only by employing a material which is harder and stronger than usual, or by enlarging the size of the bones, thus changing their shape until the form and appearance of the animals suggest a monstrosity. This is perhaps what our wise Poet had in mind, when he says, in describing a huge giant:

“Impossible it is to reckon his height “So beyond measure is his size.”

I have sketched a bone whose natural length has been increased 3 times. Its thickness has been multiplied until, for a correspondingly large animal, it would perform the same function which the small bone performs for its small animal.

From the figures here shown you can see how out of proportion the enlarged bone appears. Clearly then if one wishes to maintain in a great giant the same proportion of limb as that found in an ordinary man he must either find a harder and stronger material for making the bones, or he must admit a diminution of strength in comparison with men of medium stature; for if his height be increased inordinately he will fall and be crushed under his own weight.

Whereas, if the size of a body be diminished, the strength of that body is not diminished in the same proportion; indeed the smaller the body the greater its relative strength. Thus a small dog could probably carry on his back two or three dogs of his own size; but I believe that a horse could not carry even one of his own size.

Fig. 27

Simplicio

This may be so; but I am led to doubt it on account of the enormous size reached by certain fish, such as the whale which, I understand, is ten times as large as an elephant; yet they all support themselves.

Simplicio
Salviati
Salviati

Your question suggests another principle, which had hitherto escaped my attention.

It enables giants and other animals of vast size to support themselves and to move about as well as smaller animals do.

This result may be secured either by increasing the strength of the bones and other parts intended to carry not only their weight but also the superincumbent load; or, keeping the proportions of the bony structure constant, the skeleton will hold together in the same manner or even more easily, provided one diminishes, in the proper proportion, the weight of the bony material, of the flesh, and of anything else which the skeleton has to carry.

It is this second principle which is employed by nature in the structure of fish, making their bones and muscles not merely light but entirely devoid of weight.

Simplicio

The trend of your argument, Salviati, is evident. Since fish live in water which on account of its density [corpulenza] or, as others would say, heaviness [gravità] diminishes the weight [peso] of bodies immersed in it, you mean to say that, for this reason, the bodies of fish will be devoid of weight and will be supported without injury to their bones.

But this is not all; for although the remainder of the body of the fish may be without weight, there can be no question but that their bones have weight.

Take the case of a whale’s rib, having the dimensions of a beam; who can deny its great weight or its tendency to go to the bottom when placed in water?

One would, therefore, hardly expect these great masses to sustain themselves.

Simplicio
Salviati
Salviati

A very shrewd objection! And now, in reply, tell me whether you have ever seen fish stand motionless at will under water, neither descending to the bottom nor rising to the top, without the exertion of force by swimming?

Simplicio

This is a well-known phenomenon.

Simplicio
Salviati
Salviati

The fact then that fish are able to remain motionless under water is a conclusive reason for thinking that the material of their bodies has the same specific gravity as that of water; accordingly, if in their make-up there are certain parts which are heavier than water there must be others which are lighter, for otherwise they would not produce equilibrium.

Hence, if the bones are heavier, it is necessary that the muscles or other constituents of the body should be lighter in order that their buoyancy may counterbalance the weight of the bones.

In aquatic animals therefore circumstances are just reversed from what they are with land animals inasmuch as, in the latter, the bones sustain not only their own weight but also that of the flesh, while in the former it is the flesh which supports not only its own weight but also that of the bones. We must therefore cease to wonder why these enormously large animals inhabit the water rather than the land, that is to say, the air.

Send us your comments!